24 Jul 08
1 edit
You must see this; it's quite funny. The mystery of the 'inappropriate post' has been solved.
The reply I received from the site managers:
Sorry about the Auto Erase of your posts
GirgaSh-ites contains the word Sh-it in it. You'll need to spell this word wrong to get it through, or I can reinstate your old post... but anyone who replies to that post will have their post auto-erased as well.
P-
P.S. I added the hyphen, otherwise the site wouldn't allow the word 'GirgaSh-ites'.
24 Jul 08
So here Josh 3:10 is... finally:
10 And Joshua said, "By this you shall know that the living God is among you, and that He will without fail drive out from before you the Canaanites and the Hittites and the Hivites and the Perizzites and the Girgashi'tes and the Amorites and the Jebusites:11 Behold, the ark of the covenant of the Lord of all the earth is crossing over before you into the Jordan.
Compare Ex 23:20-30
God 1, FabianFnas 0
24 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999Read the rest of my posts... read and weep.
6 posts and nothing but BS. Are you a man or a mouse (or a politician)?
Just say it. Repeat after me ...."The case in Joshua given by FF is a an example of a prophecy that was false."
Now the question is, are you guys man enough to face the music?
24 Jul 08
Originally posted by Henry23Weep ?
Read the rest of my posts... read and weep.
Now the question is, are you guys man enough to face the music?
You are basically saying the same thing I said, but in a roundabout way
Actually this statement you made is wrong ...
Joshua 3:10 starts by saying, 'And Joshua said,' so it is not 'from the mouth of god' as you claim.
Only one verse before, 9, says
9 And Joshua said unto the children of Israel, Come hither, and hear the words of the LORD your God.
So those were the words of God spoken by Joshua.
ALso, God made the promise to Moses in Exodus but these were new promises made to Joshua. Read Joshua from the beginning.
25 Jul 08
1 edit
Originally posted by Rajk999I agree on most of what you say, but my point was this: The word were not 'from the mouth of god' as FF claimed, they were from the mouth of Joshua, even though they were 'the words of the LORD' as you rightly state.
Weep ?
You are basically saying the same thing I said, but in a roundabout way
Actually this statement you made is wrong ...
Joshua 3:10 starts by saying, 'And Joshua said,' so it is not 'from the mouth of god' as you claim.
Only one verse before, 9, says
9 And Joshua said unto the children of Israel, Come hither, and hear the words of t ...[text shortened]... Moses in Exodus but these were new promises made to Joshua. Read Joshua from the beginning.
'look and weep' was refering to your previous challenge to me to be a man and admit that FF was right, when in fact he was clearly very wrong. Now you be a man and admit it, Joshua 3:10 is not an example of false prophecy in the Bible.
25 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999And besides, are you now pretending that you believed it was a true prophecy all along?
You are basically saying the same thing I said, but in a roundabout way
Previously you said: "The case in Joshua given by FF is a an example of a prophecy that was false."
26 Jul 08
Originally posted by FabianFnasIn the light of my refutation above you might have been a bit hasty in claiming victory.
I had the postulates from henry23 and Drimachus that every prophecy is true. They bet on their honour that this postulate is true. I've found a prophecy that is false. Therefore they lost their bet. That was the deal.
We'd like to hear your comments, FabianFnas. It's your turn to either defend your 'water tight' proof, admit it's wrong, or chicken out...
26 Jul 08
1 edit
We agreed of the definition of a prophecy.
3:10 was a prophecy. 17:12-13 says it didn't went that way.
The prophecy was false.
If you deny the words of the bible, then you deny the bible, and then you deny your god.
If you agree of a definition, then after the proof was given start to twist the words of god, then you deny god.
The proof is valid, you are wrong!
There is nothing more to say about it...
26 Jul 08
Originally posted by FabianFnasTEKEL.
We agreed of the definition of a prophecy.
3:10 was a prophecy. 17:12-13 says it didn't went that way.
The prophecy was false.
If you deny the words of the bible, then you deny the bible, and then you deny your god.
If you agree of a definition, then after the proof was given start to twist the words of god, then you deny god.
The proof is valid, you are wrong!
There is nothing more to say about it...
26 Jul 08
Originally posted by FabianFnasThis is sad - you're actually trying to defend your position!
We agreed of the definition of a prophecy.
3:10 was a prophecy. 17:12-13 says it didn't went that way.
The prophecy was false.
If you deny the words of the bible, then you deny the bible, and then you deny your god.
If you agree of a definition, then after the proof was given start to twist the words of god, then you deny god.
The proof is valid, you are wrong!
There is nothing more to say about it...
Let me refresh your memory which seems to be very selective at present. In one of my previous posts I said:
I don't think you understood my previous post:
No, we don't agree on these.
So your statement that we agreed on the definition is clearly false.
Yet even according to the definition you gave Josh 3:10 would not be a prophecy. Here's your definition:
Okay, but I will use the three points anyway:
(1) When god says "this will happen", that is a prophecy. True or false?
(2) And when "this" is not happening, then the prophecies is faulty. True or false?
(3) And if I can find such a faulty prophecy, then the proof is valid. True or false?
In point (1) you state: 'When god says "this will happen", that is a prophecy.' Yet Joshua is clearly refering to Ex 23:20-30 in which God says, 'If you obey, this will happen.' So it does not fulfill your own conditions anyway!
There is a clear difference between 'this will happen' and 'if you obey, this will happen'. The only reason you don't want to acknowledge that is because that would be acknowledging that you are wrong, which you clearly aren't man enough to do.
Where is your honor now?
Besides, even if you don't acknowledge the truth, any honest person reading this thread will be able to see it for themselves. You're just making yourself look bad. 😕
26 Jul 08
Originally posted by Henry23There is some doubt whether the statement in Joshua is a conditional promise or a prophecy. A promise with a condition should not have the words 'without fail'. Its more of a prophecy.
And besides, are you now pretending that you believed it was a true prophecy all along?
Previously you said: "The case in Joshua given by FF is a an example of a prophecy that was false."
26 Jul 08
Originally posted by Rajk999There is also no doubt that Joshua was quoting what Moses said in Exodus 23:20-30, and because Joshua is quoting only a part of the promise given to Moses you have to look at the rest of the context to see what it means.
There is some doubt whether the statement in Joshua is a conditional promise or a prophecy. A promise with a condition should not have the words 'without fail'. Its more of a prophecy.
Do you know what it means to quote someone out of context? Words only have meaning in context and if you ignore the context of the words you clearly aren't interested in their meaning - you want to make them mean what the author never intended.
Read Exodus 23:20-30 again and tell me honestly that it is not a conditional promise:
"Behold, I send an Angel before you to keep you in the way and to bring you into the place which I have prepared.21 Beware of Him and obey His voice; do not provoke Him, for He will not pardon your transgressions; for My name is in Him.22 But if you indeed obey His voice and do all that I speak, then I will be an enemy to your enemies and an adversary to your adversaries.23 For My Angel will go before you and bring you in to the Amorites and the Hittites and the Perizzites and the Canaanites and the Hivites and the Jebusites; and I will cut them off.24 You shall not bow down to their gods, nor serve them, nor do according to their works; but you shall utterly overthrow them and completely break down their sacred pillars.
25"So you shall serve the LORD your God, and He will bless your bread and your water. And I will take sickness away from the midst of you.26 No one shall suffer miscarriage or be barren in your land; I will fulfill the number of your days.
27"I will send My fear before you, I will cause confusion among all the people to whom you come, and will make all your enemies turn their backs to you.28 And I will send hornets before you, which shall drive out the Hivite, the Canaanite, and the Hittite from before you.29 I will not drive them out from before you in one year, lest the land become desolate and the beasts of the field become too numerous for you.30 Little by little I will drive them out from before you, until you have increased, and you inherit the land.
26 Jul 08
Originally posted by Henry23I understood that from your previous post.
There is also no doubt that Joshua was quoting what Moses said in Exodus 23:20-30, and because Joshua is quoting only a part of the promise given to Moses you have to look at the rest of the context to see what it means.
Do you know what it means to quote someone out of context? Words only have meaning in context and if you ignore the context of the words ...[text shortened]... will drive them out from before you, until you have increased, and you inherit the land.[/i]
So there is a one yr waiting period and other conditions relating to the gods of the other people.
I did some reading around Joshua and Judges. I cant seem to find where the prohecy was actually fullfilled if at all, after the year. Did the Jews comit some wrong ?