Originally posted by @thinkofone The "logic" for many protestants seems to be:
Given:
1) My interpretation of the Bible is valid
2) The Bible is the inerrant word of God
3) Deviation from the inerrant word of God is heresy
Therefore:
1) My interpretation of the Bible is the inerrant word of God
2) Deviation from my interpretation of the Bible is heresy
Definition of ...[text shortened]... iefs or standards
Pasted from <https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/heresy>
Often they are working from Bibles that are multiple translations from the original.
Originally posted by @athousandyoung How can someone full of God's grace be a sinner? You haven't addressed the Biblical passages I quoted in Debates. The idea that Mary was sinless is entirely Biblical. I gave you the passages that explain why. But you insist on ignoring what I wrote before and insisting that this idea is non-Biblical.
[quote] you need to explain...why Peter, the ...[text shortened]... you think any church which is not led by the Bishop of Rome is consistent with Matthew 16:18-19?
GRACE
ɡrās
noun
(in Christian belief) the free and unmerited favor of God, as manifested in the salvation of sinners and the bestowal of blessings.
The bible claims God's "grace" has nothing to do with how good or righteous a person is, and that is God's grace that saves people full of sin. You're wrong about what "grace is.
Due to Catholicism, your foundation in your own Bible is poor.
Catholics merely *claim* to be the "true" Church, just like Jehovah's Witnesses claim be the "true" followers. or just like how Mormons claim they are. You can't all be right, but you can all be wrong.
(in Christian belief) the free and [b]unmerited favor of God, as manifested in the salvation of sinners and the bestowal of blessings.
The bible claims God's "grace" has nothing to do with how good or righteous a person is, and that is God's grace that saves people full of sin. You're wrong about what "grace is.
Due to ...[text shortened]... ers. or just like how Mormons claim they are. You can't all be right, but you can all be wrong.[/b]
Grace has absolutely nothing to do with the person? That's odd.
(in Christian belief) the free and [b]unmerited favor of God, as manifested in the salvation of sinners and the bestowal of blessings.
The bible claims God's "grace" has nothing to do with how good or righteous a person is, and that is God's grace that saves people full of sin. You're wrong about what "grace is.
Due to ...[text shortened]... ers. or just like how Mormons claim they are. You can't all be right, but you can all be wrong.[/b]
Mary was blessed with unmerited grace from conception so how can she be a sinner? Nobody said she EARNED grace. God blessed her so Christ would not be born from a sinful woman.
Was Jesus a sinner too?
I notice you don’t say Protestants are wrong. Which Protestant cult brainwashed YOU as a child? Were they wrong too? You aren’t arguing like an atheist. You seem to take the Bible very seriously.
Paul did not forget the Ephesians, and, from Rome, he wrote them this letter. Some scholars think that this was really a circular letter, addressed to all the churches--on the grounds that there are no personal references in it, nor does it have the opening greeting and the signoff which are so characteristic of the apostle's letters. Without the heading (which is not included in some codexes), this theory makes sense. However, the more common opinion, among ancient and modern scholars alike, is that the letter was addressed in the first instance to the Ephesians--not just because of the title it bears but because this is confirmed by Irenaeus, the Muratorian fragment, Clement of Alexandria, Tertullian and others.
Originally posted by @athousandyoung Mary was blessed with unmerited grace from conception so how can she be a sinner? Nobody said she EARNED grace. God blessed her so Christ would not be born from a sinful woman.
Was Jesus a sinner too?
I notice you don’t say Protestants are wrong. Which Protestant cult brainwashed YOU as a child? Were they wrong too? You aren’t arguing like an atheist. You seem to take the Bible very seriously.
Grace has nothing to do with whether you're a sinner or not. That's the point. Mary being "full of Grace" in no way means she wasn't a sinner. The reason you don't know this is because Catholics consider their own doctrine more important than the Bible. This is what enables their teachings to end up being heretical.
Originally posted by @vivify Grace has nothing to do with whether you're a sinner or not. That's the point. Mary being "full of Grace" in no way means she wasn't a sinner. The reason you don't know this is because Catholics consider their own doctrine more important than the Bible. This is what enables their teachings to end up being heretical.
What Biblical source do you have for your assertion? I’ve already demonstrated that you fallaciously apply Paul’s letter to Ephesus to everyone. So that won’t work. Got anything else?
So, in like manner, we Baptists have taken all the Scriptures concerning the Church (Proper) and the church (Local), and dumped them all into one basket, so to speak. We have failed to differentiate between the two, and have arrived at a similar misunderstanding.
Originally posted by @vivify That's idiotic. You think the concept of grace only applied to Ephesians? Does "thou shalt not murder" apply only to Jews?
Doesn’t matter what I think. That’s what the Bible says. The letter to Ephesus was for Ephesus.
Originally posted by @athousandyoung What Biblical source do you have for your assertion? I’ve already demonstrated that you fallaciously apply Paul’s letter to Ephesus to everyone. So that won’t work. Got anything else?
So, in like manner, we Baptists have taken all the Scriptures concerning the C ...[text shortened]... ailed to differentiate between the two, and have arrived at a similar misunderstanding.
Your argument is since that one particular passage was addressed to Ephesians, that it applies to no one else. That's fallacious, rendering your argument invalid. You're a prime example of the fallacies Catholicism produces.
Originally posted by @vivify Your argument is since that one particular passage was addressed to Ephesians, that it applies to no one else. That's fallacious, rendering your argument invalid. You're a prime example of what Catholicism produces.
I dont think either of you understand and appreciate what 'grace' means in the bible
Catholicism is heretical
30 Mar '18 20:57
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