Originally posted by josephwNo nerve hit. Just an insult received. Are you deluded Joe? Are you lying?
Why don't you all stop trying to blow smoke up my ass. We've been in this argument for years and years. Apparently a nerve has been exposed.
All you can do is deny the existence of a creator and try and lay a guilt trip on me for calling you out on being delusional. The evidence exists for intelligent design, but you have no evidence at all you can use to ...[text shortened]... old and lifeless eternity just one heartbeat away.
No God? An absolute lie. And you know it.
If you truly believe the atheists you interact with here are deluded or lying then we are done here. We won't speak again.
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by josephwYet rather than present said evidence, you hide behind the pretense that we are all lying.
The evidence exists for intelligent design, but you have no evidence at all you can use to prove a negative.
Evolution is the biggest farce ever imagined and everybody knows it.
I bet you don't know the first thing about evolution. If you did, you would know that it is undeniably very very real. It is a logical necessity.
No God? An absolute lie. And you know it.
What do you think God thinks about your lying in this thread? Do you think he approves?
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06 Mar 17
3 edits
Originally posted by twhiteheadOne would think that if such 'irrefutable evidence' existed then it wouldn't be wasted on a misnamed youtube video surely?
The video title and your subsequent comments suggest that the video was what about atheists believe not 'irrefutable evidence for the existence of a creator'.
One would think that if such 'irrefutable evidence' existed then it wouldn't be wasted on a misnamed youtube video surely?
I am willing to listen to this irrefutable evidence on one condition: you ...[text shortened]... futable evidence'. I believe posters such as Suzianne have claimed that no such evidence exists.
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The title of the video is of great significance?
It seems to be called "The Atheist Delusion".
So one would think that if it is about irrefutable evidence for God it should be titled "Irrefutable Evidence For God's Existence " ?
Okay, So if Richard Dawkin's book is about irrefutable proof of Evolution making belief in God obsolete, one would think he would not have misnamed it "The God Delusion".
So in passing he mentioned "irrefutable evidence".
So a case could be made that not all theists would call it irrefutable evidence.
Are you interested in good evidence enough to see a long video, some of which may contain good evidence for the existence of God ?
Or are you just sure there is no good evidence presented?
That would give an impression to me of stubbornness and denial to consider good arguments for an intelligence one might expect to be of a Creator God.
It would require a greater leap of something like "faith" for me to believe the DNA molecule is not the product of virtually unlimited intelligence. You might push the problem back a bit and say it is evidence of some higher intelligence perhaps of some alien mind/s.
Eventually you're going to want to ask where those minds came from.
Originally posted by sonshipIt's really entirely useless to talk to you people, isn't it? You just completely shut off your brain.
Its ok to say "The universe always was. It was not created."
I just said I don't know where the universe came from, whether it always was or whether it was created. I DON'T KNOW.
But I'm not going to just claim something in the absence of knowledge.
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by sonshipI think it came from farting pixies.Science does not claim that "all came from nothing". We actually have no idea where the universe came from and we may never find out.
So we, by our instruments of research and measurement, may NEVER find out.
But we can take a belief.
Where do you THINK it came from Great King Rat?
Just "I don't know" ?
Consider th ...[text shortened]... t.
Where do you think this universe came from ?
You're allowed to have a belief.
And I'm going to call that a belief, so now it carries some weight.
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by sonshipWhy did you just repeat yourself?? Weird.
I said you're goofy enough.
Pixies. Let's pretend belief in a Creator is just like belief in Tinker Bell ... pixies.
Ahh, that feels better.
Anyway, yeah, sounds silly, doesn't it, saying you believe in farting pixies creating the universe?
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06 Mar 17
Originally posted by sonshipEach of us has authority and responsibility to decide things for ourselves but these can be given away or taken away.
Tell me though JS357 -
Who has the final authority to decide whether something has been refuted or not ?
Since anyone may say - "This is irrefutable evidence"
And anyone else can say "No, that evidence has been refuted"
how are we going to know with infallible authority that any evidence for anything has or has not been refuted?
The way I see ...[text shortened]... will be revealed [b]"in his own time". This is the last refuter to any evidence that God is.[/b]
IMO we won't necessarily ever know the answer infallibly. Although under some theistic scenarios we may.
"Enforcement" hasn't come up in my mind. I would not think of enforcing upon others my decision on this.
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by JS357Who's being coy? Everything in existence is the evidence for a creator.
"The evidence for a creator is all that exists. "
Is the fact that things exist at all, the irrefutable evidence for a creator, or is it the fact that certain specifiable things (like, say, rational beings, or living beings) exist? Or is it something else?
Why be so coy about it?
That's why atheism is a delusion, because it denies what is in the face of overwhelming evidence, and has the obtuse idea that it can deny the existence of a creator without a shred of evidence.
Atheism is a mental disorder, the product of a disturbed mind.
And let me explain something further. If you're talking this personally, then you should reexamine your powers of perception.
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06 Mar 17
Originally posted by JS357Each of us has authority and responsibility to decide things for ourselves but these can be given away or taken away.
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It is true that each of us seems to have been bestowed with some authority and some responsibility.
IMO we won't necessarily ever know the answer infallibly. Although under some theistic scenarios we may.
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It may be necessary under certain circumstances.
You call these some theistic scenarios.
How about scenarios will turn out all turn out to be theistic?
ie. "All truth is God's truth."
"Enforcement" hasn't come up in my mind. I would not think of enforcing upon others my decision on this.
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You said about that we are each endowed with authority and responsibility.
I agree but would say there is an ultimate authority and ultimate responsibility.
You believe that there are judgments to be made but there is no last judgment.
I believe there is a last judgment with final enforcement.
I see some kind of exhaustion of longsuffering and delay and a time when put off is no more. Patience is come to an end. And for the sake of love and justice a final judgment occurs on this question of whether or not there is God.
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06 Mar 17
1 edit
Originally posted by sonship"You believe that there are judgments to be made but there is no last judgment."
[b] Each of us has authority and responsibility to decide things for ourselves but these can be given away or taken away.
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It is true that each of us seems to have been bestowed with some authority and some responsibility.
IMO we won ...[text shortened]... ake of love and justice a final judgment occurs on this question of whether or not there is God.
Not quite. I don't have a belief that I consider justified, on whether there is or isn't a last judgement.
"And for the sake of love and justice a final judgment occurs on this question of whether or not there is God."
Wouldn't there be a final judgement on whether each of us BELIEVES there is God?
And for those who were lying to themselves that there is no God, wouldn't the judgement be that they really believed in God?
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07 Mar 17
Originally posted by josephw"That's why atheism is a delusion, because it denies what is in the face of overwhelming evidence, and has the obtuse idea that it can deny the existence of a creator without a shred of evidence. "
Who's being coy? Everything in existence [b]is the evidence for a creator.
That's why atheism is a delusion, because it denies what is in the face of overwhelming evidence, and has the obtuse idea that it can deny the existence of a creator without a shred of evidence.
Atheism is a mental disorder, the product of a disturbed mind.
And let ...[text shortened]... further. If you're talking this personally, then you should reexamine your powers of perception.[/b]
Well I don't see this overwhelming evidence for either denial or affirmation of a creator existing, so maybe I'll only take it half-personally.