claim draw why not claim win?

claim draw why not claim win?

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k

washington

Joined
18 Dec 05
Moves
47023
14 May 06

if your killing somebody and in the endgame you have a queen and a rook and a bishop for instance and they have a rook why not be able to force resignation claiming a win if you can claim draws also? obviously if you could take all of thier pieces like that you could mate them right? what are your thoughts on this?

F

Joined
11 Nov 05
Moves
43938
14 May 06
1 edit

What about if your opponent has 1000 in rating, with his K+B+N to your K only? Can he claim a win?

For anyone knowing how to do it it is a clear win. But in this scenario? I would surely decline a win, he has to prove he knows how to win the game with this material.

Claiming a win can only be done when the king is about to be taken and there is no escape for him. That's the rule and that's good.

But - if you're in the position that the opponent refuses to lose but plays until he's dead mate, despite his position is dead dozens of moves ago - mess him and politely ask him to resign. It's a far better idea.

k

washington

Joined
18 Dec 05
Moves
47023
14 May 06

everyone should know the king bishop knight mate its elementry. if a 1000 player can get a bishop and a knight up on me hell yea he can claim a win. i once had a game where i had a king and rook in the dead center of the board and so did my opponent. he took every last minute until i mated him. he moved once every three days for about 13 moves. took me forever. what about that?

X
Cancerous Bus Crash

p^2.sin(phi)

Joined
06 Sep 04
Moves
25076
14 May 06

Originally posted by kmac27
everyone should know the king bishop knight mate its elementry. if a 1000 player can get a bishop and a knight up on me hell yea he can claim a win. i once had a game where i had a king and rook in the dead center of the board and so did my opponent. he took every last minute until i mated him. he moved once every three days for about 13 moves. took me forever. what about that?
Can you reliably complete a KBNK endgame in less than 50 moves?

Also, one of the most basic concepts of chess is that the game ends when checkmate occurs, a player chooses to resign or a draw is either agreed or forced. It is always a player's choice whether they resign or not, the same as it is their choice which piece they move where (within the rules). Nothing should change that or you aren't playing chess.

k

washington

Joined
18 Dec 05
Moves
47023
14 May 06

set up a none rated bishop knight or bishop bishop board and i'll mate you in under 50 moves. yes i can mate with KBN

X
Cancerous Bus Crash

p^2.sin(phi)

Joined
06 Sep 04
Moves
25076
14 May 06

Originally posted by kmac27
set up a none rated bishop knight or bishop bishop board and i'll mate you in under 50 moves. yes i can mate with KBN

Nearing 250000...!

Joined
23 Mar 04
Moves
250388
14 May 06

Hey, a new board in the forums too with the newest release? Looks nice. Now we just need the number and letters of the rows and columns, and preferable FEN-based motion of the moves sequence.

The RudeĀ©

who knows?

Joined
30 Dec 03
Moves
176648
15 May 06

Originally posted by kmac27
if your killing somebody and in the endgame you have a queen and a rook and a bishop for instance and they have a rook why not be able to force resignation claiming a win if you can claim draws also? obviously if you could take all of thier pieces like that you could mate them right? what are your thoughts on this?
Never heard of timeouts and stalemates?

Your pc can crash and you'll get timeouted or maybe you play without paying attention and you make the stalemate move.

The "claim win" option is a really dumb and arrogant thing.

k

washington

Joined
18 Dec 05
Moves
47023
15 May 06

Bb4

Secret RHP coder

on the payroll

Joined
26 Nov 04
Moves
155080
16 May 06

Originally posted by kmac27
if your killing somebody and in the endgame you have a queen and a rook and a bishop for instance and they have a rook why not be able to force resignation claiming a win if you can claim draws also? obviously if you could take all of thier pieces like that you could mate them right? what are your thoughts on this?
My thoughts? This is a terrible idea.


Black to move.

The position corresponds to your scenario; White is 'killing' Black in the endgame, with exactly the material advantage you described; yet Black has mate on the move.

k

washington

Joined
18 Dec 05
Moves
47023
16 May 06

games that have been claimed draws are reviewed so im sure they can review games such as claim win. especially on the people who take every last minute to move!

Secret RHP coder

on the payroll

Joined
26 Nov 04
Moves
155080
16 May 06

Originally posted by kmac27
games that have been claimed draws are reviewed so im sure they can review games such as claim win. especially on the people who take every last minute to move!
Draw claims don't need to be reviewed at all. Draws by 3-fold repetition, 50-move rule, and insufficient mating material are all easy programmed into the game interface.

If claiming wins was allowed, everyone would do it. Some would do it in lost positions out of sheer spite. Volunteer reviewers would be up to their eyeballs in poorly thought out or outright false claims. And all this because you're too lazy to play the damn game out until checkmate, and too impatient to wait for someone who is moving within a mutually-agreed time control!

k

washington

Joined
18 Dec 05
Moves
47023
16 May 06

some people use millions of different of moves before claiming draws just to do it. thats also why theres a claim draw button. so if somoene is prolonging a already for sure lost game why can't it be forced to be finished

For RHP addons...

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Joined
16 Mar 04
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15013
17 May 06

Originally posted by kmac27
some people use millions of different of moves before claiming draws just to do it. thats also why theres a claim draw button. so if somoene is prolonging a already for sure lost game why can't it be forced to be finished
Worst idea ever.

D

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Cancerous Bus Crash

p^2.sin(phi)

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06 Sep 04
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17 May 06

Originally posted by kmac27
some people use millions of different of moves before claiming draws just to do it. thats also why theres a claim draw button. so if somoene is prolonging a already for sure lost game why can't it be forced to be finished
If you want the game finished so bad then offer a draw. If the ending is as lopsided as you claim then they'll accept. If you want the win then quit whining and play it out. Should be easy for an expert such as yourself.