White To Play and Win

Hmmm, at first I thought of this well known motive, where white gives 2 pawns to free the way for the 3rd.



But that doesn't seem to work here. I think it has to be won on the queens wing though due to the kings positions and the fact that it's White's turn. Will have to try some more. There's aren't too many possibilities 🙂

Originally posted by crazyblue
Hmmm, at first I thought of this well known motive, where white gives 2 pawns to free the way for the 3rd.

Yes, from your diagram White mates in 14, beginning with 1. b6!

perhaps white needs to apply that motif to both wings?

I tried all kind of pawn move combinations now. I get only draws (4 pawns remain on each side and kings cant pass the middle) or if White gives to many pawns, then Black wins. But I dont see how White can force a win...

Originally posted by doublez
perhaps white needs to apply that motif to both wings?

And even if that was done, the side to move and win must have their pawns closer to the promotion square than the other sides, or it'll be a draw. So I don't think that's the right way to go about it.

Originally posted by THUDandBLUNDER
[fen]5k2/8/pppppppp/8/PPPPPPPP/8/8/5K2[/fen]

If I select the 'text' that includes the chessboard - you know, hold the left click and drag it over the chessboard - the Black King looks like the Overmind, the White King looks like a bug eyed alien or praying mantis or something, the White Pawns look like little duckies and the Black Pawns look like they are flipping me off.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
If I select the 'text' that includes the chessboard - you know, hold the left click and drag it over the chessboard - the Black King looks like the Overmind, the White King looks like a bug eyed alien or praying mantis or something, the White Pawns look like little duckies and the Black Pawns look like they are flipping me off.

you are a really strange person😲

Originally posted by THUDandBLUNDER
[fen]5k2/8/pppppppp/8/PPPPPPPP/8/8/5K2[/fen]

This is tough but if White are to win, I'd go for 1.d5

Originally posted by ilywrin
This is tough but if White are to win, I'd go for 1.d5

Yes, that's the first move.

I can find wins against all Black defences except
1. d5 cxd5
2. exd5 Kf7!

Originally posted by ilywrin
This is tough but if White are to win, I'd go for 1.d5

I let fritz 8 loose on it and it could only draw.

Originally posted by sonhouse
I let fritz 8 loose on it and it could only draw.

Because it can't resolve far enough to see the win it can't play accurately enough to win. It suggests 1. b5 I'd guess.

Originally posted by THUDandBLUNDER
Yes, that's the first move.

I can find wins against all Black defences except
1. d5 cxd5
2. exd5 Kf7!

Does White need to recapture on d5?
Why not try 2.a5!? bxa5 3.b5 axb5 4.cxb5 Ke7 5.b6 Kd7 6.g5, etc
I am not sure this works though 😉

Originally posted by ilywrin
Does White need to recapture on d5?
Why not try 2.a5!? bxa5 3.b5 axb5 4.cxb5 Ke7 5.b6 Kd7 6.g5, etc
I am not sure this works though 😉

Firstly, White can win only by forcing a passed pawn on each wing and queening one before Black.

After 1. d5 cxd5 White should play 2. exd5 (rather than cxd5) in order to keep 3 connected pawns on the queenside.

A typical winning line might be
1. d5 cxd5
2. exd5 exd5
3. a5 bxa5
4. b5 axb5
5. cxb5 Ke7
6. b6 Kd7
7. b7 Kc7
8. b8Q+ Kxb8.
9. g5 fxg5
10. h5 gxh5
11. f5 winning.

But if Black doesn't obligingly play 2.. exd5, what can White do about the pawn on e6 - which helps to prevent White from forcing a passed pawn on the King side.

Trying your suggestion:
1. d5 cxd5
2. a5 bxa5
3. b5 axb5
4. cxb5 Ke7 (because Black will lose the pawn race)
5. b6 and yes, it does seem to win!

(By P. Cathignol, 1981)

I remember reading that the position below is also winning for White (not sure if the Kings are on bishop's file or queen's).
But one would probably need a program like Freezer to prove it.


.

Originally posted by THUDandBLUNDER

A typical winning line might be
1. d5 cxd5
2. exd5 exd5
3. a5 bxa5
4. b5 axb5
5. cxb5 Ke7
6. b6 Kd7
7. b7 Kc7
8. b8Q+ Kxb8.
9. g5 fxg5
10. h5 gxh5
11. f5 winning.

Trying your suggestion:
1. d5 cxd5
2. a5 bxa5
3. b5 axb5
4. cxb5 Ke7 (because Black will lose the pawn race)
5. b6 and yes, it does seem to win!

In that winning line you posted Black will win, because his king can stop the f-pawn. But if you play the moves 9 to 11 before you play the moves 6-8, then it's still the idea you had and White will win.

In the 2nd suggestion I dont see how 5. b6 will win, because there is no pawn race. Black will just stop the pawn with his king, while his own pawn will promote.

So I'd go for the first winning line with swapped moves. However it's still the problem, that Black can play other moves in 1. and 2. Is there actually a forced solution for this for all variations? Somehow I'd like to see it now :-)