22 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by Fat LadyI just did a quick experiment with a random, big club in the States so that I could see if any lower rated USCF players also had recent FIDE ratings.
I think the high end USCF ratings are a little inflated compared with FIDE, but it is difficult to tell for players below 2000 USCF because FIDE is very much aimed at stronger players.
I chose the Miami International Chess Academy.
Here's what I came up with (trust me I checked all the names thoroughly):
Miami International Chess Academy
Member USCF---FIDE rating
FM Martinez 2469---2430
IM Lugo 2429---2380
FM Lopez 2409---2414
FM Torres 2229---2259
NM Medina 2213---2202
Cabrera 2093---1964
Haskel 2063---2131
Galofre 2050---2284
Bendana 1980---2108
Here are some more lower rateds I found, this time from NYC's Queens Chess Club. They were selected objectively - they're the only ones I could find with both FIDE/USCF ratings to compare:
Ryba 2032---2101
Frumkin 2025---2043
Arluck 1998---2034
Cimafranca 1942---2081
Kleinman 1879---2033
Muwwakkil 1811---1937
Top 10 USCF rateds and their FIDE ratings:
GM Kamsky 2799---2725
GM Nakamura 2760---2699
GM Onischuk 2719---2659
GM Seirawan 2685---2634
GM Christiansen 2680---2588
GM Schulman 2676---2639
GM Kaidanov 2661---2595
GM Akobian 2659---2619
GM Becerra 2656---2614
GM Benjamin 2650---2583
So in conclusion it seems from my laughably small sample, that at higher ratings the USCF rating is perhaps slightly inflated over the FIDE.
At lower levels the reverse would seem to be the norm.
22 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by Squelchbelchlower levels probably play less FIDE tournaments, so the USCF rating displays their progress faster.
I just did a quick experiment with a random, big club in the States so that I could see if any lower rated USCF players also had recent FIDE ratings.
I chose the Miami International Chess Academy.
Here's what I came up with (trust me I checked all the names thoroughly):
Miami International Chess Academy
Member USCF---FIDE rating
FM Martine ...[text shortened]... ps slightly inflated over the FIDE.
At lower levels the reverse would seem to be quite common.
also, the class players probably differ from most other countries because of the huge american scholastic scene. the ratings distribution is just very different, and you can see it pretty much everywhere online as well. the low end of american scene is extremely wide. and because of that alone, a working formula is probably impossible to find.
22 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by heinzkatYes, according to the conversion formula. But keep in mind that the scatter plot shows that the data points below USCF 1800 are few and widely scattered. (i.e., major extrapolation going on down in that part of the plot.)
So 1500 USCF ~ 1248 FIDE.
22 Jan 09
Originally posted by wormwoodThere does seem to be a strong trend that below 2200 FIDE you can expect the USCF rating to be lower than the FIDE one.
lower levels probably play less FIDE tournaments, so the USCF rating displays their progress faster.
also, the class players probably differ from most other countries because of the huge american scholastic scene. the ratings distribution is just very different, and you can see it pretty much everywhere online as well. the low end of american scene is extremely wide. and because of that alone, a working formula is probably impossible to find.
I'd like some objective evidence to the contrary.
22 Jan 09
Originally posted by Squelchbelchhow do you mean 'a strong trend'? the uscf ratings have been almost invariably higher than fide when I've come across people with both. not that I had done any real research on it though.
There does seem to be a strong trend that below 2200 FIDE you can expect the USCF rating to be lower than the FIDE one.
I'd like some objective evidence to the contrary.
22 Jan 09
2 edits
To answer the original question, there is a formula here to convert national ratings to BCF: http://www.englishchess.org.uk/grading/2002/how_it_works/conversion.htm
A 1500 USCF would convert to a 113 BCF.
I don't think it's meaningful to try to convert ratings lower than Expert to FIDE; how many people rated in a lower grade play in FIDE tournaments? I didn't even know you could!
22 Jan 09
2 edits
Originally posted by SquelchbelchProbably the best objective data is this scatter plot of recent USCF members who also had FIDE ratings. (from Mark Glickman's site)
There does seem to be a strong trend that below 2200 FIDE you can expect the USCF rating to be lower than the FIDE one.
I'd like some objective evidence to the contrary.
http://math.bu.edu/people/mg/ratings/uscf_fide.jpg
Edit: I'll leave it to you and wormwood to decide who's right. 🙂
22 Jan 09
Originally posted by wormwoodAnd that case be member of both organization and devote your life to catch your USCF rating with your FIDE. Now that would be a progress 😛
how do you mean 'a strong trend'? the uscf ratings have been almost invariably higher than fide when I've come across people with both. not that I had done any real research on it though.
22 Jan 09
Originally posted by wormwoodHave a look at my stats above^^
how do you mean 'a strong trend'? the uscf ratings have been almost invariably higher than fide when I've come across people with both. not that I had done any real research on it though.
From 12 players rated between USCF 2229 & 1811
10 have higher FIDE ratings than USCF.
I'd call +83% a trend, considering the players where objectively chosen.
I don't buy all this "lower levels probably play less FIDE tournaments, so the USCF rating displays their progress faster" stuff.
If anything that should mean the USCF rating is higher in comparison!
The best way is to look up another big US chess club where several strong intermediates also have FIDE ratings & then compare.
I'm sorry but conversion formulae mean very little if real world results point in a different direction.
I may do this later if I get the chance.
22 Jan 09
Originally posted by no1marauderThe formula given in that page doesn't give any justification for applying the "old" ECF (BCF) to FIDE conversion formula when converting between ECF grades and national ratings, but 1500 USCF ~= 113 ECF sounds like the right sort of figure. I'd like to see some empirical evidence though, surely someone on this site has both a USCF rating and an ECF grade?
To answer the original question, there is a formula here to convert national ratings to BCF: http://www.englishchess.org.uk/grading/2002/how_it_works/conversion.htm
A 1500 USCF would convert to a 113 BCF.
I don't think it's meaningful to try to convert ratings lower than Expert to FIDE; how many people rated in a lower grade play in FIDE tournaments? I didn't even know you could!
22 Jan 09
Originally posted by heinzkatI am quite certain that Bobby Fischer is the only player who has ever achieved a USCF rating above 2800 (2815 if I recall correctly). Also, I seem to recall that his FIDE rating at that time was 2780.
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About 30 years ago, an IM used to be rated around 3000 (!) USCF. The USCF ratings have been corrected since then, but the numbers still tend to be "high" I believe.
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