Originally posted by FabianFnas
"I certainly didn't say a black hole came to the center of the solar system."
You certanily did. In order to bend the light from the sun, then you obviously have to have the bender, the black hole, somewhere in between the sun and the observer on Earth. Where in the whole universe would that be if not in the central part of the solar system? Sometimes wh n try. Sorry for that. The explanation is googable, and that I advice you to do.
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I certainly didn't say a black hole came to the center of the solar system."
You certanily did.
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No I didn't. Why would I ? I know that the sun occupies that place of center. And I had no intention of speaking about its destruction.
I wrote something like, what IF a black hole
entered the solar system. Now you can
quote me if you disagree.
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In order to bend the light from the sun, then you obviously have to have the bender, the black hole, somewhere in between the sun and the observer on Earth.
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You are trying to make what you think I implied what I said or
wrote. Be honest here please.
Cut and paste me where I wrote that a black hole came to the
CENTER of the solar system.
My working assumption was and still is that perhaps within the roughly 93,000,000 average miles between earth and the sun, maybe a small black hole could have
entered into the solar system bending sunlight.
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Where in the whole universe would that be if not in the central part of the solar system? Sometimes when I read your words, you don't seem to know how the solar system is built. ..
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The question is what I said. And you have lost that case.
I did not
SAY a black hole came to the center.
Do you think I was born yesterday ? I can see when someone is trying to put words in my mouth. By saying
"You certainly did" and reasoning as you are you trying to put words in my mouth.
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"http://www.neverthirsty.org/pp/historical-secular-quotes-about-jesus/thallus.html"
Yes yes, but not a word from the best astronomers of that time, the chinese astronomers.
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Raising the bar ? Now it has to be a word from the BEST astronomers of the time.
Maybe the "BEST" astronomers were off studying something else. Maybe we just don't have a record of what if anything were their comments.
I don't think your complaint lowers the significance of what we do have.
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They didn't see a thing. Wonder why?
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You don't KNOW that they didn't see a thing.
You simply want to discount the significance of what we do have as a record.
Lame.
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No, it's just a story, invented from the beginnign of some odd reason.
(Thank you for the ref, btw, I read more from that site later.)
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You don't know that either.
That's your desperate conspiracy theory.
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"I mean "How can SPACE be curved?""
If you read and understand Einsteins explanation, then you have your answer there.
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Thanks. Of course understanding Einstein's technical explanation is not something everyone is trained to do.
Some teachers are good at making deep physics clearer to the laymen. For example, the Teaching Company has some excellent college level lectures on Relativity. And I have listened to those lectures more than twice.
Still, though many things became clearer to me, the curvature of SPACE around mass is still a big mystery to me. I have seen many many grids, examples and diagrams.
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This is basic physics, so if not the physics books can help you, then how can I explain it for you in a few words? But look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spacetime and see if it makes clearer.
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I don't think you can help me because I am not sure you understand yourself the curvature of SPACE.
The brush off and wink does not persuade me that you really understand what I am asking about.
I still regard space as nothing. Now I hear things occasionally that space is not nothing.
Mind you I do not despise the concept of space curvature around mass. I just find it hard to imagine. And I find it hard to get it explained to me.
I do not intend to give up, the way some people "give up" on the Bible.
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"I believe the account of the book of Joshua. And I believe the account of Hezekiah's sun dial shadow moving backwards."
If you easily can believe what they explained thousands of years ago and still think that that explanation is good and sound, despite that thousands of years of scientific progress can deliver better explanations nowadays, then your time is not now. You live in the past.
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Maybe I don't "easily" believe it. But I believe it.
My decision to trust the Bible came gradually along with my decision that the integrity of Jesus Christ was beyond reproach. I noticed that Jesus took the Old Testament seriously. So I eventually decided that if it was good enough for Jesus, it must be Okay.
That is how I got over my typical modern day arrogance and skepticism to believing the Bible.
As for "living in the past" that is a ridiculous charge to me. And I think an explanation of God the Creator performing something miraculous for His eternal purpose is a good explanation.
I do not divorce the miracle from the context. You seem to care absolutely nothing for the context and just lift from the pages a perculiar curiosity which you assume is unrelated to anything other then itself.
I consider not just what was done, but
WHO did it. I didn't just pick up a funny strange little event as a isolated perculiarity. I considered the context of God's character and God's purpose as laid out in the whole Scripture.
I think science should continue to study as long as they can. I like science. My major was in Computer Science and I consider myself at least one who appreciates
logic otherwise I could not have worked 30 years in the field.
I probably don't know as much physics as others here. I still give place to God the Creator being able to make an exception with His laws of physics and doing a miracle for His purposes. Or perhaps He arranged something to happen which we could explain some day.
I do not think Science has at all made belief in God obsolete.
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You live in an era where many things are well understood, and well explainable, even to children in elementary schools.
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If you are putting forth a concept that because many things are well understood, so we no longer need to believe that an eternal God who created the universe could not do something miraculous for His purposes, I part with you there.
The encreased understanding of Science is every year adding to the realization of Intelligent Design behind the universe to some of us.
Technology is reading OUT of nature the intelligent laws that some Mind put INTO nature.
So elementary school kids understand more things today then learned scientists did 1000 years ago. You don't think I know that ???
How FAR are you going to take that ? Are you going to say that for that reason we can discard the possibility of the Creator of the cosmos doing the miraculous should it serve Divine purpose to do so ?
I am not going to take it that far. I am not going to make that leap of faith - that because we understand more today, THEREFORE the ultimate power and authority of God the Creator we can relagate to superstitious ideas of the past.
That is a leap that you are making. I am not taking our advance in knowledge that far. And given another 1500 years of progress in science, neither then would I relegate God to the obsolete.
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You give me a lot of questions. I miss some - please remind me of these questions.
You also give me questions that needs a lot of explaing, more or less impossible to explain in such a media as this. Forgive me that I don't even try. Sorry for that. The explanation is googable, and that I advice you to do.
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Its understood.