Originally posted by robbie carrobie
She symbolizes ALL the elect of God
this has no basis in reality and is unsubstantiated with any values other than those which you are willing to impose on the scripture. Furthermore i demonstrated that Biblicaly women are used to represent organizations, e.g.The bride of Christ, The nation of Israel.
I refuse to speculate about the sun and th ...[text shortened]... e idea i have no idea.
The rest of your post is beneath my dignity to honor with an answer.
She symbolizes ALL the elect of God
this has no basis in reality and is unsubstantiated with any values other than those which you are willing to impose on the scripture. Furthermore i demonstrated that Biblicaly women are used to represent organizations, e.g.The bride of Christ, The nation of Israel.
It has every basis in proper interpretation of the Holy Bible.
The
New Jerusalem is this same woman from another angle.
And the New Jerusalem contains both the saints of the old covenant and the new covenant. The names of the twelve tribes are on her gates. The names of the twelve apostles are on her foundations. Certainly patriarchs are included in that eternal city as well.
I am saying that the universal bright woman is also the New Jerusalem.
It is only that different aspects are represented.
The woman in Revelation 12 is still prior to the consummation of God's work throughout history. And the New Jerusalem is the same universal gathering of believers after the consummation of His work.
The Woman of Revelation 12 is also the Women who is the Bride and Wife of the Lamb in Revelation 21 and 22.
Forget about it representing a cult of Christ denying millennialists attempting to bring people back to the Old Testament by fighting against the incarnation of God in Christ.
That group of people is on the side of the Dragon and are opposed to Jesus Christ and all that He represents - the union of God and man.
Oh, they may want a Paradise like Eden in the beginning, but on THEIR terms.
I refuse to speculate about the sun and the moon and stars for it is not the point of this discussion.
Then you are glossing over important details. Everything the Bible mentions is significant. Not a word is wasted or there just to take up space.
If you gloss over the
details of the vision assuming they are just pretty ornaments that have little significance, you can forget about getting into a book like Revelation, let alone the whole Bible.
The stars which form her crown should not be the same stars which the dragon hurls to the earth with its tail. So
"stars" there must have another significance.
Interpreting the Bible with the Bible. the twelve patriarchs are the best choice mentioned so far.
The saints of God stand in grace.
The law of Moses is subject to those who stand in salvation through grace.
That is why she is CLOTHED with the sun and has the moon underneath her feet.
This moon being underneath her feet does not represent any kind of disrespect. It indicates that the Law of God is not the main matter by which she is justified. Rather the Grace of Christ is her main clothing and the Law as means of justification is subject to her rather then her subjected to the Law. It is seen underneath her feet as she is not justified by law keeping but by the grace of the New Testament.
The patriarchs though who were of faith and not of law keeping, are exalted though. That is why the stars form a crown. She exalts is exalted with a crown of the patriarchs of faith. The law keepers are not exalted as the patriarchs of faith are.
The dispensation of the Law is not disrespected for too was a time of God's light on earth. But it is not exalted as the patriarchs of faith before the Law.
No one has claimed that any organization in Brooklyn or anywhere else on the planet is represented by what is written in revelation chapter 12 and to say so seems to be to be indicative of a kind of lunacy,
You used the word "organization" before I did.
The church is not an organization. It is an organic Body.
If you have dentures your body knows that they are not organically part of your body. They are a foreign element. In the same way "organized organization" of the Christian body is a foreign element to the organic nature of life.
Yes, there are many organizations called denominations. But those are made and eventually pass away. That is depicted in Revelation 17.
In Revelation 12 the woman is first SEEN in heaven. This means that her SOURCE is in heaven and spiritual. The vision is seen in heaven from the standpoint of God's purpose. And that is as an organic Body - a Woman not a Babyon of divisions and denominations from which God calls His people to
"Come out of her".
This woman is seen at least four times in the Bible.
Genesis 3,
Ephesians 5,
Revelation 12,
Revelation 21,22.
The harlot of Revelation 17 might be considered the negative view of the facade of this woman the corrupted Christiandom. And the woman in Revelation 18 is the city of
Rome for the most part.
There is some overlap because the Harlot is based in Rome. The corrupted Christiandom has its head quarters in Rome. So some overlap between the religious Babylon and the material Babylon occurs there in chapter 18.
I know this book better than you do.
I know this book better than your teachers do.
No brag - just frank fact.
or at the very least an inability to think rationally for its quite a ludicrous assertion, if i am honest.
Your shooting at me with no result. No hits.
Don't take what I wrote if you don't want to.
It is your loss. But for one who is deceived that the Son of God is Michael the angel I can see why you would be so darkened and confused. They ruined your beliefs. They ruined your ability to see clearly the revelation of the word of God.
Insult is not meant.
I'm just telling you the truth.
Your view has been damaged for ascertaining spiritual things presented in the Bible.
Again no one has said it represents the faithful steward or anything other than Gods heavenly organization, made up of God himself and the angelic creatures. Where you get the idea i have no idea.
The rest of your post is beneath my dignity to honor with an answer.
Your being incensed is the anger of Satan against the Lord Jesus.
He has filled your mind with rage at the truth.
I will address my future comments to someone else on this chapter.
Don't read my comments. They will fill you with more rage against the Lord Jesus.