Terms and conditions clarification

Just thought that 3(b) should be clarified more considering it still causes confusion to some players.

Currently it shows:

(b) You will not use chess engines, chess software, chess computers or consult any third party to assist you in any game. Chess books and databases can be consulted during play

I think it should show:

(b) You will not use chess engines, chess software, chess computers or consult any third party to assist you in any game. This also includes checking moves you have already played in the current game in progress, or checking your opponent's moves. Chess books and databases can be consulted during play.

In the FAQ you could have a question "Why can't you check moves with engines you have already played in the current game?"

Then go onto explaining the reasons. For example, even checking moves that have already been played can give insight to future moves.

An example:
You've just played move 10 in a current game. Now you want to know if move number 9 was a good or bad move using a computer, asking dad, discussing it in a forum etc. Can you do it?

If the answer is "no", then your revision of 3b is good.
If the answer is "yes", unless this help doesn't give clues of the choice of moves you will do, then the today's 3b is good as it is.

May I discuss the dragon variation with a friend if I have a game in progress with dragon line but way past theory?

Originally posted by FabianFnas
An example:
You've just played move 10 in a current game. Now you want to know if move number 9 was a good or bad move using a computer, asking dad, discussing it in a forum etc. Can you do it?

If the answer is "no", then your revision of 3b is good.
If the answer is "yes", unless this help doesn't give clues of the choice of moves you will do, then ...[text shortened]... ariation with a friend if I have a game in progress with dragon line but way past theory?

You can talk about the dragon, but you can't ask your friend a question based on your position in a game.

If you set the board up to look like your game with another player here at RHP and start asking about the next best move... you've just cheated.

P-

Originally posted by FabianFnas
An example:
You've just played move 10 in a current game. Now you want to know if move number 9 was a good or bad move using a computer, asking dad, discussing it in a forum etc. Can you do it?

If the answer is "no", then your revision of 3b is good.
If the answer is "yes", unless this help doesn't give clues of the choice of moves you will do, then ...[text shortened]... ariation with a friend if I have a game in progress with dragon line but way past theory?

Ok then, maybe my revision should be specific to checking past moves using an engine.

Originally posted by lausey
Ok then, maybe my revision should be specific to checking past moves using an engine.

People have been booted for getting help from another human. I believe one player was talking about how him and his dad loved to sit and talk about the next best move. They were removed for 3(b)

No outside help is no outside help, it goes beyond just engines.

P-

Originally posted by Phlabibit
People have been booted for getting help from another human. I believe one player was talking about how him and his dad loved to sit and talk about the next best move. They were removed for 3(b)

No outside help is no outside help, it goes beyond just engines.

P-

My thoughts exactly.

Originally posted by lausey
Ok then, maybe my revision should be specific to checking past moves using an engine.

To clarify, you should never talk about a game in progress, engine or human. Wait for the game to finish, or you've cheated.

P-

Originally posted by GinoJ
My thoughts exactly.

I think the line btween inside 3b and outside 3b can vary a lot.
There are situations where some people think it is within the rule and other think it is outside the rule.

My rule is simpler: Common sense. Don't show your game in progress to others, not in any forum, not with friends, not nowhere with no one. Only in this way you cannot get any good (or ill) advices and no one can point fingers in your direction with the accusations of cheating.

But re line according with 3b is not that sharp as it should be. But this sharp line cannot be defined exactly. Common sense is good enough for me.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
I think the line btween inside 3b and outside 3b can vary a lot.
There are situations where some people think it is within the rule and other think it is outside the rule.

My rule is simpler: Common sense. Don't show your game in progress to others, not in any forum, not with friends, not nowhere with no one. Only in this way you cannot get any good ( ...[text shortened]... t should be. But this sharp line cannot be defined exactly. Common sense is good enough for me.

I have an OTB buddy and he started to play chess here online. We got together and I had saved some of my past games onto my laptop to share and get his comments on.

I opened up a game, and he said, "This is a game you've finished, right?"

I said, "yes".

He said, "Ah, very good". So, although he's more an OTB player... he still knew that a game in progress should not be talked about in any way.

P-

Once, when I was very young, before the Internet era, I had games in progress in a handy booklet with movable pieces. I showed this to my friend and he started instantanously analyzing the games and giving me good advices. I agreed on his advices and played them. He asked about the games and I showed him againd and gave me new fresh advices. After a while I thought that he, not me, was playing the games, and I felt cheated of good games. So I stopped playing altogether, lost the games and enver started play in this play form again. I felt as I was the cheated one, not my opponents. It was a long time ago.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Once, when I was very young, before the Internet era, I had games in progress in a handy booklet with movable pieces. I showed this to my friend and he started instantanously analyzing the games and giving me good advices. I agreed on his advices and played them. He asked about the games and I showed him againd and gave me new fresh advices. After a while ...[text shortened]... this play form again. I felt as I was the cheated one, not my opponents. It was a long time ago.

Good on you for figuring that out on your own and resigning.

P-

Originally posted by Phlabibit
To clarify, you should never talk about a game in progress, engine or human. Wait for the game to finish, or you've cheated.

P-

Ok, what I said wasn't very clear enough. I meant the actual revision referring to checking past moves using an engine, but future moves still cannot be assisted by any outside source. Hence being:

(b) You will not use chess engines, chess software, chess computers or consult any third party to assist you in any game. You cannot use engines to check on your's or your opponent's previous moves where the game is still in progress. Chess books and databases can be consulted during play.

Originally posted by lausey
Ok, what I said wasn't very clear enough. I meant the actual revision referring to checking [b]past moves using an engine, but future moves still cannot be assisted by any outside source. Hence being:

(b) You will not use chess engines, chess software, chess computers or consult any third party to assist you in any game. You cannot use engines to ch ...[text shortened]... re the game is still in progress. Chess books and databases can be consulted during play.[/b]

You can not use Engines, or consult ANYONE to check on your's or your opponent's previous moves where the game is still in progress.

Originally posted by Phlabibit
You can not use Engines, [b]or consult ANYONE to check on your's or your opponent's previous moves where the game is still in progress.[/b]

Ok, maybe it should be revised to this then for clarification. 🙂