What did Jesus sacrifice?

@moonbus raised this issue recently.

If Jesus ~ believed to be a divine being who has always existed and always will exist ~ supposedly went back to being God again after being executed by the Romans ~ and was never not-God during his years of being God incarnate on Earth ~ what exactly did he sacrifice?

@fmf said
@moonbus raised this issue recently.

moonbus: He knew he would rise again three days later. Not much of a sacrifice, was it? I too would sacrifice anything if I knew I’d get it back three days later. A mortal who gives his life for his comrades’ lives and who stays dead has my respect.

@fmf said
@moonbus raised this issue recently.

If Jesus ~ believed to be a divine being who has always existed and always will exist ~ supposedly went back to being God again after being executed by the Romans ~ and was never not-God during his years of being God incarnate on Earth ~ what exactly did he sacrifice?

Once again, there are those here trying to use human logic and reasoning to explain a divine act. It doesn't work that way. As I've said here before - there are some things one has to take on faith.

A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them, and said "Peace be with you" Then he said to Thomas "put your finger here, see my hands, reach out your hand and put it on my side, stop doubting and believe" Thomas said: "My Lord and My God!" Then Jesus told him. "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen, and yet have believed" John 26-29

@mchill said
Once again, there are those here trying to use human logic and reasoning to explain a divine act. It doesn't work that way. As I've said here before - there are some things one has to take on faith.

I am well aware of the catch-all assertion that "God moves in mysterious ways" etc, etc.

But you have not answered the question.

You either DO think Jesus sacrificed [i.e. the human word "sacrificed"] something or he DID NOT.

If you think he DID sacrifice something, what was it?

If you think DON'T think he sacrificed something, what would be a better word [than "sacrificed"] to describe what you understand him to have done?

@fmf said
I am well aware of the catch-all assertion that "God moves in mysterious ways" etc, etc.

But you have not answered the question.

You either DO think Jesus sacrificed [i.e. the human word "sacrificed"] something or he DID NOT.

If you think he DID sacrifice something, what was it?

If you think DON'T think he sacrificed something, what would be a better word [than "sacrificed"] to describe what you understand him to have done?

But you have not answered the question.


Sorry - but I have no answer for you. Scripture states that Jesus is the Son of God. It also states that Jesus became a human (the word made flesh) and dwelled among us for a time, to be a sacrifice for the sins of humanity. This would seem to be a staggering contradiction, would it not?

All I can suggest is that we mortals don't possess the capacity to fully comprehend the life, and acts of Jesus. He could have remained an obscure carpenter but chose a very different path. Trying to find an answer to your question, though noteworthy, simply won't happen in this life.

@fmf said
@moonbus raised this issue recently.

If Jesus ~ believed to be a divine being who has always existed and always will exist ~ supposedly went back to being God again after being executed by the Romans ~ and was never not-God during his years of being God incarnate on Earth ~ what exactly did he sacrifice?

It all about “eternity”…

I’ve also raised an issue related to your OP with kellyjay regarding this point. That is rgarding the outcome of some of his beliefs when collated and reviewed from the perspective of “eternity”, which is of course the finality of all this temporal process.

The example question I gave was this:
Given an eternal perspective would you rather be temporally formed as a foetus who is aborted or a prisoner on death row?

Now the doctrines and beliefs put forward in this forum by certain Christians are as followers:

1) eternity is where we all end up, Christian or non Christian. The former group in eternal heaven and latter group in eternal hell being burnt alive forever. By Jesus no less.

2) there are only a “few” who find eternal heaven and therefore the vast majority find eternal hell (a failure numerically speaking)

3) an aborted, or indeed a miscarried foetus is a person who goes to straight to heaven.

4) a non Christian inmate on death row is executed and goes straight to eternal hell.

Given the perspective of eternity vs three score years and ten, then I would chose to be an aborted foetus as the doctrinal view of the “few” indicates that statistically speaking, my chances of living a good life, finding the narrow gate and straight path and getting into heaven a very slim.

Doctrines and beliefs must be able to withstand scrutiny when they are conjoined, not just when they stand alone.

@mchill said
John 26-29

I'm curious as to how you link John 26-29 to the OP question.

@fmf said
I'm curious as to how you link John 26-29 to the OP question.

Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen, and yet have believed"

I think there is some link between this quote and the OP question here.

@mchill said
Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen, and yet have believed"

I think there is some link between this quote and the OP question here.

In what way?

@fmf said
@moonbus raised this issue recently.

If Jesus ~ believed to be a divine being who has always existed and always will exist ~ supposedly went back to being God again after being executed by the Romans ~ and was never not-God during his years of being God incarnate on Earth ~ what exactly did he sacrifice?

There is no good answer here. From a human standpoint Jesus did nothing of great value. But that is not even an issue neither is it something anyone needs to believe. There are many righteous who will see the Kingdom of God without knowing a single thing about the reasons for the death and resurrection of Christ.

The sacrifice of Christ was an arrangement or promise God had made with Adam after they first sinned, that a saviour would come who will destroy the works of Satan.

Jesus's death and resurrection, gave Him the status and authority to destroy Satan and to redeem from the earth all, from Adam to the end of the world, those who keep his commandments.

@mchill said
Sorry - but I have no answer for you. Scripture states that Jesus is the Son of God. It also states that Jesus became a human (the word made flesh) and dwelled among us for a time, to be a sacrifice for the sins of humanity. This would seem to be a staggering contradiction, would it not?

All I can suggest is that we mortals don't possess the capacity to fully comprehend th ...[text shortened]... ath. Trying to find an answer to your question, though noteworthy, simply won't happen in this life.

You seriously don't have any belief you can share about what it was that Jesus sacrificed?

@fmf said
You seriously don't have any belief you can share about what it was that Jesus sacrificed?

Sinless, became sin, God, became a man and endured all that He did including being
punished for all of the sins we did. I figured being an ex-Christian you'd remember
that, but I guess your Anti-Christ mindset ignores that.

@kellyjay said
I figured being an ex-Christian you'd remember
that, but I guess your Anti-Christ mindset ignores that.

There's really no point appealing to stuff I haven't believed for two decades. That would be you scraping the rhetorical barrel.

@kellyjay said
Sinless, became sin, God, became a man and endured all that He did including being
punished for all of the sins we did.

Yes, having been a Christian, I know what the dogma is. But Jesus went back to being God again after being executed by the Romans. So what did he sacrifice?

@kellyjay said
Sinless, became sin, God, became a man and endured all that He did including being
punished for all of the sins we did. I figured being an ex-Christian you'd remember
that, but I guess your Anti-Christ mindset ignores that.

God became a man and endured all that He did including being punished

Yes, but what did he sacrifice if he lost nothing and returned to what he was before?