1. SubscriberSuzianne
    Misfit Queen
    Isle of Misfit Toys
    Joined
    08 Aug '03
    Moves
    36625
    16 Aug '19 14:03
    @bigdoggproblem said
    I don't agree. God's offering to save people from natural disasters is no more a violation of their free will than, say, for a human to save people from drowning by offering them a lifeboat. They don't have to take it. They have free will still. They can choose to accept, or swim for shore on their own, or give up and drown.

    For some reason, you seem to think it's d ...[text shortened]... to make sure there is incomplete information so that some of the people will screw up on the choice.
    No. Clearly given a large enough number of people and a clear choice between God and 'not God', some will choose God of their own volition and some will choose 'not God' of their own volition.

    Now if God shows up and says "Here I am, yes I exist, and I have all these powers you've heard about, and I can save you from all evil and take you to Heaven", who would say "no"?

    It's like a politician showing up at the voting booth and saying "I will pay everyone who votes for me $100,000." Who would say "no"? There's a reason why that is illegal.

    When the choice is between something obviously good, and something obviously sufficiently not good, then what kind of choice is that? With God being proven, it leaves mankind no choice. The choice has to be made without coercion in order to be a valid choice.

    It is a measure of faith to make the right choice. God wants people who choose him because they love him, not people who choose him merely for what they get out of the deal.
  2. SubscriberSuzianne
    Misfit Queen
    Isle of Misfit Toys
    Joined
    08 Aug '03
    Moves
    36625
    16 Aug '19 14:171 edit
    @kellyjay said
    John 6:44
    No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him.
    I've always had a problem with this verse.

    Do you think it means that God chooses who he will take and who he will not? That some people are destined to be the black sheep who will not see God?

    I don't think so. He wants all to come to salvation. This is the entire reason for free will. Why do you think we are charged with spreading the Good News?
  3. Standard memberKellyJay
    Walk your Faith
    USA
    Joined
    24 May '04
    Moves
    157806
    16 Aug '19 14:522 edits
    @suzianne said
    I've always had a problem with this verse.

    Do you think it means that God chooses who he will take and who he will not? That some people are destined to be the black sheep who will not see God?

    I don't think so. He wants all to come to salvation. This is the entire reason for free will. Why do you think we are charged with spreading the Good News?
    I think it shows two things the first being we would not come unless He calls us, then the importance of answering when He does. Life will just consume us with the ins and outs if we ignore Him otherwise.

    He uses us in this effort.
Back to Top

Cookies help us deliver our Services. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Learn More.I Agree