Christ's Death Grounded in the Supernatural

@mike69 said
This is only something I’m dealing with at the moment and not directed at anyone, being an internal self imposed question brought on by the conversation. How well am I releasing my current feelings and understanding of Gods Word along with my ability to discern between my internal voice and Gods and how well is this currently known understanding flowing outward and is this my unknowing self intent for whatever reason or is this how God would like his river to flow.

Mike69, was there a question mark intended in that last sentence?

How well are you doing in this matter?
Is there anything else you feel comfortable to share here?

@sonship said
Please give now your strongest examples of me changing the word of God.

You have added to the word of God, changing the original meaning.

Happy to dig out all the Witness Lee stuff if you want examples?

The Apostle Peter confirms that Christ's death was foreknown in a supernatural way before the foundation of the world.

"Knowing that it was not with corruptible things, with silver or gold, that you were redeemed from your vain manner of life handed down from your father, But with the precious blood, as of a Lamb without blemish and without spot, the blood of Christ;

Who was foreknown before the foundation of the world but has been manifested in the last of times for you sake, " (1 Pet. 1:19,20)

Christ's incarnation, living, death and resurrection were foreknown before the foundation of the world. The New Testament teaches how supernaturally His death was, grounded in an eternally foreknown even before the creation of the universe - before the foundation of the world.

Who was foreknown before the foundation of the world but has been manifested in the last of times for you sake, " (1 Pet. 1:19,20)

It is wonderful to know God made provision for our sins even before we were born, even before the foundation of the world. Christ's atonement and sacrificial giving of Himself for us redemption is supernaturally grounded.

In these last days if you doubt you are saved you should ask of God to make sure your name is written in the Lamb's book of life so that you will not be deceived by the coming Antichrist.

"And all those dwelling on the earth will worship him, [antichrist], everyone whose name is not written in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain from the foundation of the world. If anyone has an ear, let him hear." (Rev. 13:8,9)

Christ's death for you is supernaturally grounded. God desires all men to be saved and to come to the full knowledge of the truth.

Jesus regarded His own death for salvation something that He could hardly wait to accomplish. By it He knew He would resurrect and send His Holy Spirit into the believers on the earth. This He said was His casting fire upon the earth. He was constrained to do so and could not until His death be accomplished.

"I have come to cast fire on the earth, and how I wish that it were already kindled!

But I have a baptism to be baptized with, and how I am pressed until it is accomplished! " (Luke 12:49,50)

The "baptism" He spoke of was his approaching crucifixion's at Golgotha.

In this terrible "baptism" the Son of God was not only tortured by men. He was immersed and plunged under the wrath of God's judgment against sin.

He was additionally judged by God for the sin of the world. It pleased God to lay upon Him the iniquity of us all. Jesus wanted to accomplish this being plunged into the baptism of His being judged that He might subsequently send His Holy Spirit into men's hearts - casting fire upon the earth.

His death was grounded in the transcendent and supernatural love of God for
each of us PERSONALLY.

@sonship said
He was additionally judged by God for the sin of the world. It pleased God to lay upon Him the iniquity of us all. Jesus wanted to accomplish this being plunged into the baptism of His being judged that He might subsequently send His Holy Spirit into men's hearts - casting fire upon the earth.

His death was grounded in the transcendent and supernatural love of God for
each of us PERSONALLY.

God judges Himself for the sin of man brought into the world (by two fictional humans in a garden). Is that what you believe?!

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

I believe that you have no idea of your origin, or destiny, or purpose. And you come here as a little yelping dog to bark at those who know because they receive God's speaking.

I believe that you could not two or more consecutive phrases together to teach anything positive or hopeful about the nature and purpose of human beings.

Yelping along the sidelines like a noisy little dog at Christians is all you can ever do on the Spirituality Forum.

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

I believe that you have no idea of your origin, or destiny, or purpose. And you come here as a little yelping dog to bark at those who know because they receive God's speaking.

I believe that you could not two or more consecutive phrases together to teach anything positive or hopeful about the nature and purpose of human beings.

Yelping al ...[text shortened]... e sidelines like a noisy little dog at Christians is all you can ever do on the Spirituality Forum.

Neither of us knows the exact process of our origin. You seek to plug this shared ignorance with fairytales. That is your perrogative.

Destiny? Purpose?

As a species, no more than reproduction, survival. As individuals, whatever drives us, family, happiness, exploration.

Better a dog than a lost sheep.

@eladar said
@mike69

So you believe God would not be defined as supernatural?

You know just because something can not be explained does not make it supernatural. What may seem supernatural today may just be the technology of the future. We can't know gods complete nature in our existence as it is now as we do not have the experience needed for the qualities we may think we know. Without beginning or without end, comes to mind. We can't know how that happens as we have never seen or experienced it in all of known nature. The title of the thread has some failings by using just the word supernatural. Supernatural to God? Supernatural to Jesus? Supernatural to men? Since man cannot know all of nature how does one ever know what is grounded in the supernatural that we may know nothing about? Just because a person doesn't know how something works doesn't give license to assign it one way or another. Although the whole thing is kind of silly it is still fun to contemplate.

@joe-beyser said
You know just because something can not be explained does not make it supernatural. What may seem supernatural today may just be the technology of the future. We can't know gods complete nature in our existence as it is now as we do not have the experience needed for the qualities we may think we know. Without beginning or without end, comes to mind. We can't know how that ...[text shortened]... ign it one way or another. Although the whole thing is kind of silly it is still fun to contemplate.

You know, if the universe was created by God, a being that existed before this universe, then God would be by definition supernatural.

Of course if God did not create the universe, then the Bible is simply wrong. As far as the God as described in the Bible goes, He simply does not exist.

Either God as described in the Bible is supernatural or simply does not exist.

@eladar said
You know, if the universe was created by God, a being that existed before this universe, then God would be by definition supernatural.

Of course if God did not create the universe, then the Bible is simply wrong. As far as the God as described in the Bible goes, He simply does not exist.

Either God as described in the Bible is supernatural or simply does not exist.

I like that. If God existed before our universe then that is outside of our existence and natural laws. So to man, God is supernatural and anything done by him could be considered supernatural as well. If it is assumed that the story of Jesus is true, then his birth, death, and resurrection would be supernatural. So the original posters title for this thread basically would assume Christ's existence on earth but assigns a connection and purpose with God. Very few scholars deny the existence of the man Jesus. Some do but most say he was a Jew and practiced the Jewish customs and religion. If he is the real messiah which the Jews have good scriptural reason to not believe, he endorses the God of the Jews and worshipped him. For Christianity to be true so does the Jehovah of the old testament. The trinitarians believe Jesus and the father are one but hard to fathom Jesus wishing men women and children to be killed but be good with taking the virgin women for themselves. Same with killing disobedient children. The old testament is full of stuff Jehovah did that doesn't ring true with a god of love or what the message of Jesus was. The treatment of women and the practice of stoning people to death for fairly minor infractions that the Jews did based on their law doesn't give a great deal of confidence to the nature of their god. There is a problem there so I have to think Jesus would not have worshipped or endorsed the father spoke of in the bible and yet the bible shows he did when the two are not compatible. To me it doesn't look likely it was supernatural.

@joe-beyser

So you are saying you have problems reconciling the Jesus of the NT with the OT.

I think many people who call themselves Christian today should have the same issue.

@eladar said
@joe-beyser

So you are saying you have problems reconciling the Jesus of the NT with the OT.

I think many people who call themselves Christian today should have the same issue.

I just cant get the two to fit together.

@joe-beyser said
I just cant get the two to fit together.

You cannot fit the God of the OT with Jesus who told a guy not to bury his dead father, but let the dead bury the dead? You think the Jesus who said only a small number of people will find the narrow road to salvation is any different than the God of the OT?

So was Jesus an ET?
Ancient Astronaut Theorists say yes.