The science of face masks

@wildgrass said
By polarity I was referring to the use of polarized materials to create a local electrostatic charge in the mask. N95 respirators employ an electrostatic mechanism to attract and intercept foreign particles (charged or uncharged). These electrostatic interactions are essential to raise the filtration of N95 masks to the 95% level.

Thank you for clarifying. I was wondering.
I think I should point out that many (if not most but I admit I really don't know whether if it is not most) of the masks worn by (most?) people don't use such an electrostatic mechanism in particular and just rely instead on filtering very simply via like a sieve. I know my one certainly does; although in the case of my one, that's because its home made and just made out of cotton. I read such a home made one, providing it is made will with the more tightly woven types of cotton fabric and providing its multi-layerred, should filter out something like ~70% of the virus; not as good as the more professional ones you can buy but a lot better than nothing!
Off course, if a reasonable and cost effective mask can be made with pore size always less than 20nm, not only would that filter out all covid-19 but filter out near enough all types of virus even without electrostatic mechanism so there would then be no need for an electrostatic mechanism. But we will just have to wait and see for that one.

@metal-brain said
You are lying again. You have no such proof. It does not exist.

copy - paste - my previous links showing this evidence, proof in fact;

https://www.europeanscientist.com/en/public-health/how-effective-are-face-masks-at-slowing-spread-of-coronavirus/
By far, the strongest evidence for mask-wearing can be found in real-world data or so-called epidemiologic data. Leffler and colleagues analysed data on demographics, testing, lockdowns, and the public wearing of masks from 196 countries and found that countries with cultural norms or government policies supporting public mask-wearing had much lower per-capita mortality rates (1)
...
Another study from Germany reported that face masks reduced the number of newly registered SARS‐CoV‐2 infections by between 15 and 75 per cent over a 20-day period after their mandatory introduction (2). Overall, the authors estimate that face masks reduce the daily growth rate of reported infections by around 47 per cent.
...
The general consensus seems to be that masks – even, simple cloth ones – while clearly not foolproof can significantly slow the spread of the virus and reduce deaths
..."

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02801-8
Face masks: what the data say
The science supports that face coverings are saving lives during the coronavirus pandemic,
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/cloth-face-cover-guidance.html
Evidence for Effectiveness of Masks
...emerging evidence from clinical and laboratory studies that shows masks reduce the spray of droplets when worn over the nose and mouth.
https://theconversation.com/masks-help-stop-the-spread-of-coronavirus-the-science-is-simple-and-im-one-of-100-experts-urging-governors-to-require-public-mask-wearing-138507
The evidence
...There are numerous studies that suggest if 80% of people wear a mask in public, then COVID-19 transmission could be halted.
...laboratory and epidemiological evidence...

https://www.wsj.com/articles/face-masks-really-do-matter-the-scientific-evidence-is-growing-11595083298
Face Masks Really Do Matter. The Scientific Evidence Is Growing.
Face masks are emerging as one of the most powerful weapons to fight the new coronavirus, with growing evidence that facial coverings help prevent transmission
The research Dr. Redfield cited included a recently published study suggesting that universal use of surgical masks helped reduce rates of confirmed coronavirus infections among health-care workers at the Mass General Brigham health-care system in Massachusetts.
Researchers from around the world have found many different kinds of masks can significantly reduce the spread of coronavirus,
Their findings largely align with other recently published research.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/facemasks-shown-to-cut-spread-of-covid-19-9r92zfpb8
Facemasks slow spread of coronavirus by 40 per cent, study shows

etc.

In fact, as you can see above, there is clearly to any non-moron that bothers to just read it, that there so much evidence and its so good we can call it proof.

Well?

@humy said
copy - paste - my previous links showing this evidence, proof in fact;

https://www.europeanscientist.com/en/public-health/how-effective-are-face-masks-at-slowing-spread-of-coronavirus/
By far, the strongest evidence for mask-wearing can be found in real-world data or so-called epidemiologic data. Leffler and colleagues analysed data on demographics, testing, lockdowns, and t ...[text shortened]... bothers to just read it, that there so much evidence and its so good we can call it proof.

Well?

...that bothers to just read it...

Herein lies the problem.

@humy said
copy - paste - my previous links showing this evidence, proof in fact;

https://www.europeanscientist.com/en/public-health/how-effective-are-face-masks-at-slowing-spread-of-coronavirus/
By far, the strongest evidence for mask-wearing can be found in real-world data or so-called epidemiologic data. Leffler and colleagues analysed data on demographics, testing, lockdowns, and t ...[text shortened]... bothers to just read it, that there so much evidence and its so good we can call it proof.

Well?

The first link you posted is not one specific study. I am not going to read a dozen articles just because you are copy and paste crazy.

Pick one single article that you think proves your claim. I don't have time to read more than one. I have a life.

Epidemiologic data does not prove what the article claims. The data is not supported in Michigan, I can tell you that for sure. Mandatory face mask wearing coincided with sharp increase in cases. Mortality rates have been dropping all along because treatment is getting better.

Correlation is not proof of causation. If it was you would conclude the flu vaccine causes covid19. There is a correlation there too.

@wildgrass said
By polarity I was referring to the use of polarized materials to create a local electrostatic charge in the mask. N95 respirators employ an electrostatic mechanism to attract and intercept foreign particles (charged or uncharged). These electrostatic interactions are essential to raise the filtration of N95 masks to the 95% level.

If everyone was wearing N95 masks it might help somewhat. That is not the case though. That means not one study about N95 masks is relevant to the population in general. After all, what good is a study about masks that most people don't wear at all?

This is why most studies involving masks are irrelevant. You have to test what people are wearing. By including studies of masks most people do not wear we are being bombarded with misinformation and it is deliberate. People know nobody wears wet washcloths on their faces.

@metal-brain said
I am not going to read a dozen articles just because you are copy and paste crazy.

In other words, you call me a liar for saying there is evidence but when I show you the evidence you refuse to read it.

@metal-brain said
If everyone was wearing N95 masks it might help somewhat. That is not the case though. That means not one study about N95 masks is relevant to the population in general. After all, what good is a study about masks that most people don't wear at all?

This is why most studies involving masks are irrelevant. You have to test what people are wearing. By including studies o ...[text shortened]... ed with misinformation and it is deliberate. People know nobody wears wet washcloths on their faces.

Might help somewhat? It's an airborne virus.

The information you keep parroting is incorrect.

You started this thread stating that "there is no evidence wearing face masks is effective" but fail to recognize the important distinction between ' no evidence' and 'I don't like to read'.

@humy said
In other words, you call me a liar for saying there is evidence but when I show you the evidence you refuse to read it.

I told you I would read one that proves your statement. You don't need multiple articles to prove it. Even if you do to prove different mask effectiveness you can start with one.

Agreeing to read one study is not a refusal to read. You are being dishonest.

@wildgrass said
Might help somewhat? It's an airborne virus.

The information you keep parroting is incorrect.

You started this thread stating that "there is no evidence wearing face masks is effective" but fail to recognize the important distinction between ' no evidence' and 'I don't like to read'.

The information you keep parroting is incorrect.
I never refused to read or even said I didn't like to.

You are lying now. There is no evidence face masks are effective. I even showed you how they could do more harm than good from reputable sources.

Your whole flawed logic is based on the assumption that face masks have to at least help to some degree. That is a false assumption. If you have any degree of respect for science you will acknowledge that.

If you want to prove something you have to do just that. Lying is just making you look like a sore loser.

@metal-brain said
I told you I would read one that proves your statement. You don't need multiple articles to prove it.

How do you know I don't need multiple articles to prove it? I say multiple articles combined from multiple studies are probably needed to prove it.
Why would you still refuse to read it just because I posted more than one? -you make no sense and fool nobody here.

@metal-brain said

I never refused to read

"I am not going to read a dozen articles ..." (your quote)

And to any non-moron that bother to read just, say, two of them, the evidence is conclusive; face masks slow the spread. You are fooling nobody here and are just embarrassing and shaming yourself.

@metal-brain said
The information you keep parroting is incorrect.
I never refused to read or even said I didn't like to.

You are lying now. There is no evidence face masks are effective. I even showed you how they could do more harm than good from reputable sources.

Your whole flawed logic is based on the assumption that face masks have to at least help to some degree. That is a ...[text shortened]... u want to prove something you have to do just that. Lying is just making you look like a sore loser.

There is no evidence face masks are effective.

How did you show me they did more harm? Are you referring to the hypothetical mid-March remarks by the Surgeon General?

You could say "I am not aware of the evidence" or (if you read the study) you could say "I think this study was done incorrectly because... " or some variation thereof. But if you are not going to read any of the studies that demonstrate mask efficacy it is completely absurd to say "there is no evidence".

You seem like a child complaining the food is terrible while refusing to taste it.

@wildgrass said

You could say "I am not aware of the evidence" or (if you read the study) you could say "I think this study was done incorrectly because... " or some variation thereof. But if you are not going to read any of the studies that demonstrate mask efficacy it is completely absurd to say "there is no evidence".

Exactly the point and well put.

@humy said
"I am not going to read a dozen articles ..." (your quote)

And to any non-moron that bother to read just, say, two of them, the evidence is conclusive; face masks slow the spread. You are fooling nobody here and are just embarrassing and shaming yourself.

Stop lying!

@wildgrass said

There is no evidence face masks are effective.

How did you show me they did more harm? Are you referring to the hypothetical mid-March remarks by the Surgeon General?

You could say "I am not aware of the evidence" or (if you read the study) you could say "I think this study was done incorrectly because... " or some variation thereof. But if you are not g ...[text shortened]... no evidence".

You seem like a child complaining the food is terrible while refusing to taste it.

Are you referring to the hypothetical mid-March remarks by the Surgeon General?

Yes, but it was not hypothetical. He gave specific reasons masks may do more harm than good. Do you think he made it up?