gravitons..

so what's taking so long to find one? And no..a Gravitational wave is NOT the same thing

@ogb said
so what's taking so long to find one? And no..a Gravitational wave is NOT the same thing

We actually knew that😉 And the reason they haven't been found is perhaps they just don't exist. BTW, there are gravity waves like in the atmosphere and there are gravitational waves like LIGO detected.

@ogb said
so what's taking so long to find one? And no..a Gravitational wave is NOT the same thing

Lazy scientists.

@sonhouse said
We actually knew that😉 And the reason they haven't been found is perhaps they just don't exist. BTW, there are gravity waves like in the atmosphere and there are gravitational waves like LIGO detected.

If gravitons don't exist what is waving?

@metal-brain said
If gravitons don't exist what is waving?

Other than that the other forces we observe are quantized there is no real evidence for gravitons. However, whether gravity is quantized or not what "waves" is the metric tensor. Classical General Relativity predicts gravitational waves without needing to be quantized.

@deepthought said
Other than that the other forces we observe are quantized there is no real evidence for gravitons. However, whether gravity is quantized or not what "waves" is the metric tensor. Classical General Relativity predicts gravitational waves without needing to be quantized.

I expected someone to say it is space-time itself that is waving. I have never heard anyone claim it is the metric tensor. A metric tensor is a measurement of a field. It cannot possibly wave.

You seem to be hung up on the metric tensor for some strange reason. It seems like anything you cannot answer you claim it is a metric tensor.

@metal-brain said
I expected someone to say it is space-time itself that is waving

Neither the graviton nor the space-time waves - the mind waves. Thus sayeth the tortoise to Achilles.

@shallow-blue said
Neither the graviton nor the space-time waves - the mind waves. Thus sayeth the tortoise to Achilles.

Gravitational waves were discovered. Something is waving.

@metal-brain said
I expected someone to say it is space-time itself that is waving. I have never heard anyone claim it is the metric tensor. A metric tensor is a measurement of a field. It cannot possibly wave.

You seem to be hung up on the metric tensor for some strange reason. It seems like anything you cannot answer you claim it is a metric tensor.

Well, that's because the metric tensor completely describes the field (actually it overdescribes it). In your final sentence you made a statement that cannot be correct - that because the metric tensor is a measurement of a field it cannot wave. The first problem is that it is not a measurement of a field, it is a description. The second, and rather more severe, problem is that the field patently changes, otherwise there could be no dynamics at all, nothing that gravitates could move otherwise it would alter your static field. An alternative sense of your statement is that the measurement cannot change, but a measurement happens, as an idealisation, at a particular point and a particular time. Successive measurements would reveal an oscillation, the metric describes this but is not in itself a measurement.

@deepthought said
Well, that's because the metric tensor completely describes the field (actually it overdescribes it). In your final sentence you made a statement that cannot be correct - that because the metric tensor is a measurement of a field it cannot wave. The first problem is that it is not a measurement of a field, it is a description. The second, and rather more severe, proble ...[text shortened]... surements would reveal an oscillation, the metric describes this but is not in itself a measurement.

A description cannot possibly wave. You are still making no sense.

@metal-brain said
A description cannot possibly wave. You are still making no sense.

Stop trying to be clever, you're no good at it.

@deepthought said
Stop trying to be clever, you're no good at it.

It is called logic. Try it sometime.

I can describe waves in the water. Is it the description that is waving or the water? It is the water.

A description cannot possibly wave. You are still making no sense.

@metal-brain said
It is called logic. Try it sometime.

I can describe waves in the water. Is it the description that is waving or the water? It is the water.

A description cannot possibly wave. You are still making no sense.

If the description does not have propagating oscillations in it then it's a bad description, so both if you think about it.

@deepthought said
If the description does not have propagating oscillations in it then it's a bad description, so both if you think about it.

You know better. You really should give it up.

@metal-brain said
It is called logic. Try it sometime.

I can describe waves in the water. Is it the description that is waving or the water? It is the water.

A description cannot possibly wave. You are still making no sense.

You think gravitons would be analogous to water particles in a wave?